introduce ourselves um i am here with my two colleagues today so i'm here with enrico he's from mark pilot a company that we're working closely with and he and his team um they are working with clients on market intelligence and using that to make very data-driven decisions on offering and pricing i'm also here with my colleague andre andre is a specialist in the machinery industry is working um across commercial topics since 15 years for all the way from offering strategy uh to monetization topics and myself patrick also focusing on specifically on monetization strategies and market insights now just looking also at the chat and who is on i see well a few people um customer insight and strategy uh from swiss also director services on switzerland so um yeah a few people uh different profiles a few locations uh germany um switzerland great to have you all on the call and also we um are we have planned to talk for uh roughly 30 minutes 35 minutes so that we also have time at the end to answer your questions so feel free to just um put the questions in the chat we have time um towards the end to then go into those so let's get started what is on the agenda for today so three things so first we get started to set the scene what are current challenges and opportunities that we see when we talk to clients the second thing is about a deep dive where we really go into content uh also with a case to discuss how companies can harness the power of data and combine it with market intelligence and then third again a deep dive really we go deep here with a case on how companies can design smart differentiators winning offers to monetize them so let's get started so when we discuss with clients we see uh and we hear several challenges and we synthesize them into five key challenges that we find so the first is very much decline in core machine sales and that's quite substantial um we hear really about um uh cyclical the cyclical downturn uh delayed investments and uh even when we talk to market leaders we see actually um reduction in new machine sales up to well in the two digit space so it's quite substantial increasing the focus on the existing on the installed base that brings us to the second challenge slow growth of service revenue and also here we see um while there was an expectation that this continues that we see um a higher increase um in service revenue uh growth we see um uh and what we hear um and what we hear delayed investments um customers holding back on contracts um customers holding back on contracts so also here um the the environment getting tougher which is also related to the third point margin pressure increasing client pushback so often uh it's now the procurement team that actually has greater transparency transparency also asks um um requests transparency pushes back on prices which makes negotiations much harder to do and also asks um requests transparency pushes back on prices which makes negotiations much harder to do and also requests transparency uh and also uh the need for uh the need for actually articulating the value of the the products the services um much more acute um that also brings us to the fourth point the emerging competitive um models uh so also from new entrants uh innovative incumbents are bringing different models um into play um so if you think of paper use um paper for performance so very much changing the landscape of what is offered changing um how the value proposition is brought into the market uh is brought into the market uh which is a good thing but at the same time is also increasing the pressure for existing players in the market to also keep up to innovate and then lastly um that's the macro and the trade disruptions what we hear and what we see all across the globe um from tariffs trade restrictions the general uncertainty which is very much something that actually cuts across so as you will um a perfect storm but we still see there is an opportunity for growth and that opportunity for growth and that opportunity is actually often overlooked when we talk to clients this is specifically focusing on monetizing um after sales and just now as a bit of a way to illustrate this if you have a look at the left hand side here um where to make where do machine machinery companies building companies make the money uh so if you look at new machine sales obviously this is the biggest part up to 80 percent here we have margins 15 percent but often lower you have margins 15 percent here sometimes even negative if you look at the after sales business obviously smaller in proportion um only 20 to 40 percent in revenue but actually margins here are actually quite good uh they start from 30 percent all the way to 95 percent depending on the role of of the service of the parts so definitely that's where um you actually make your money and now just a way to illustrate this think of two scenarios think of you're a company with 400 million revenue revenues in new equipment sales 100 million in after sales services now if you put in effort and you push your volume of new machine business by 10 percent and assuming a 10 percent margin that gives you 4 million euro in margin margin impact bottom line now if you do the same effort and you push your new your service business by 10 percent volume of it then and assuming here a margin 50 percent that gives you actually 5 million in profit uptake so while it's smaller um but with a similar growth you actually end up with a higher impact on the bottom line so a huge opportunity um still often overlook but then you might ask where to focus on and how to get started to do that we have our growth map which we um have here on the left hand side it's about the service portfolio that actually many um machinery companies have quite wide you start from spare parts consumables all the way to technical training and on the right hand side we just listed um the main revenue profit leavers there are others but um many um very much across go to market commercial excellence offering but all the way also to efficiency delivery excellence with a lot of ai topics coming in there as well now the question is how do you find how do you map the the the right service to the right leaver where can you find commercial opportunity where can you find untapped potential and that's exactly what we want to discuss today for that we focus on two things uh first we focus on um the spare parts and consumables and look into how can we refine pricing to actually calibrate it to market level make it actually more competitive but at the same time also align it with value so that's deep dive number one and Rico will talk about this shortly and then we also have our second deep dive which is around services maintenance repair and then we focus on the digital remote service and monitoring a lot of services but how can you actually refine the offering how can you package them and create a package offering that creates an upsell path and um and improve selling so two deep dives um a lot of content uh with that i'm handing over to um andro thank you patrick for setting the scene and buongiorno also from my side exactly so now i'm going to talk about there's a lot of the uh how you can um how you can um harvest your internal data and combine it with market intelligence to really realize growth potential in your after sales business and uh patrick already set the scene about how the machine uh companies have their revenue streams distributed so there's a new new machine business and the after sales business and in the after sales business because i've seen that not everyone in the in the rich among the registrator the registered users participants um is from within an org service organization so i wanted to to explain you a little bit how these service organizations are set up so within the after sales business we usually see the classical service this is when technicians go out and maintain machines for example or you do you do retro bits on the other side there's a spare parts business and the spare parts business is usually divided into two parts there's a there's the drawing part business so parts that are designed specifically for the company for the machines of these of this company and there are the purchase parts the purchase parts are parts from siemens bosch festo so there are standard parts that you can buy everywhere and some facts about these different parts and this is exactly what we will focus on drawing parts they usually have very much high margin because yeah due to their exclusivity because yeah due to their exclusivity the purchasing parts have less margin and also much more competition because obviously you can buy them in different dealers now online there's much more transparency um and uh within the after sales business you can say that these spare parts are actually the area where the companies really earn their money so there are margins on average about 50 60 or even 70 percent just as a little background so said that if you have growth goals within your after sales business it's inevitable inevitable to talk about the parts business because here actually you you can make the money right and i just listed a few goals that i often hear from companies when i'm talking to them and i think they they sound quite familiar to many of the participants here it's about increasing revenue and margins it's about uh improving the customer satisfaction and actually in the the after sales business and the after sales business there's a great opportunity for that because in my opinion there's only one way or there are a few points within the within customer touch points where you define the reputation and pricing image of your company and that is how much do you charge for your technician hours and for what price are you selling your standard your purchasing parts because here you are directly uh comparable to the market then often there are uh growth goals for the growth goals for the growth goals or it goes for the improvement of regional and uh channel sales channels pricing performance and then i just listed also the improve of stock management and purchasing condition because that's something many people many service organizations also need to handle and whenever you have growth goals within these areas a starting point is data and often it's internal data to actually identify where are growth opportunities within your after sales business within your and how can you find your first part business and how can we leverage them to leverage and to realize the potentials external data can be super useful because it explains you how to act on the potentials you identified internally so let me explain that with a case so here we are talking about a company where the global service director reached out to us because he realized okay i'm not achieving macro goals we're talking about a company in material handling there are two main markets where europe and north america with roughly the same installed base and the problem the company had was that the growth of the parts business was lacking behind the growth of the new machine business and about their setup they had roughly 40 000 active sku stock keeping units with a rough distribution of 50 purchasing parts and 50 drawing parts and i said the problem was that the problem was that the problem was that the machine business was growing by 15 percent every year however the parts business was lacking behind in europe in service terms you would even say it was stagnating because it was only growing by four percent i guess many of the service people here know that often growth goals are much more ambitious and um in north america the business was a little bit more successful and behind the the company was growing by nine percent so the company was growing by nine percent so the company had the question how can they develop and implement a pricing strategy that helps them to reach the after sales growth goals and to improve their overall pricing performance within the service organization so they started exactly at that point they analyzed the internal data and i just want to highlight a few findings they got from this analysis so in europe they realized that the the revenue parts revenue is not really the revenue is not really growing actually drilling down a little bit on the on the revenue streams they saw that their purchase parts didn't grow at all they stagnated completely only the revenue of the drawing parts slightly increased then they also realized that even though the installed base is growing and growing they don't receive more requests for offers and they didn't send more offers than the last years so there was something not right that the customers didn't trust the company entirely and the win rate was also decreasing um combined with a decreasing uh customer satisfaction in north america however they saw some um some growth but it still lagged behind the the new machine business growth um they realized that the revenue per machine was bigger than in europe it's quite interesting and they also had higher win rates than in europe so they reached out and what we did together is we compared their prices to the market prices and let me explain that here briefly so when we analyze a portfolio of purchasing parts the parts that are comparable in the market we always see more or less the same picture so there are roughly 50 percent of the parts that are exclusive meaning there is no competition in the market even though we are talking about purchasing parts that are purchasing parts that should be comparable the reason for that is because often you have parts that are um out of production so you are the only one that still have these parts on stock sometimes data quality is not good enough sometimes your supplier is a small manufacturer somewhere in italy who doesn't even have the capabilities to to sell worldwide to all your customers and then there's the other part the other roughly 50 percent where you have competition and there you have competition and there we see that the prices compared to the market are roughly distributed equally so half of the prices are overpriced and the other half are underpriced and then a few of them are in line with market what we uncovered for that company is that in europe they were heavily overpriced and looking at the situation on the left i think that already is a can explain why is a can explain why why they identified the these things in there or these results in their internal analysis in america in america however or north america they had a bigger share of exclusive parts i guess it's mainly because the company has its headquarter in europe so the machine consists of european parts and they're not as available in the north american market which actually in these times which actually in these times is super interesting because what we see is that with customers with which we work already for a long time the share of exclusive parts in north america is increasing and increasing because of the terrors the resellers in europe and in north america they really consider what are the parts they want to have on stock so that information can be gold if you know you are the only one selling these parts in north america so to go a little bit further deeper what we actually did so with that company we analyzed 1500 parts in both in the european and north american market and as you already can see we didn't research their entire portfolio we started small to realize the first great wins during that analysis we identified more than 3 000 competitors that were offering some or several of the of the parts the company was selling and we found more than 25 5 000 information uh for price points and delivery times so it's quite a competitive market right and the company then was able to um to see exactly how not only are we overpriced or underpriced but also to see exactly how much are we overpriced one so they really realized that the deviation um of their price to the market level and that enabled them to act on individual parks level um to set the right price and that's a of their price for highly Eleven to set the mark pilot software helps a lot because you can set up a strategy that our customers usually do together with our uh customer success managers so we really develop something that matches your reality so you can in a very lean process adjust your prices but there's much more potential behind that because with all that information you for example can start gaining market share you can understand by how much do we need to get to that to decrease the prices of the parts that we never sell to start selling them and you don't go the risk that you just decrease these parts parts slightly and earn less but most of the customers still don't start buying it so you know exactly where you know need to position yourself by implementing a lot of parts on the market level you also can increase as i mentioned before your customer satisfaction heavily and often for the really for the really overpriced parts um you're having often the reason for that is bad purchasing conditions so sometimes you also identify where do we need to improve our acquisition cost so for that company that meant um that we increased their spare parts revenue um in the first six month six months already by five percent that's because they on that in the beginning they really captured the quick wins so they increased prices where they realized we are way too low and in two years horizon we increased year over year 12 percent revenue um because they also decreased prices at some point obviously because it's not only about increasing but also working on the on the reputation of the company uh improved heavily uh improved heavily their their margins for their for the spare parts uh not only for the purchasing parts where we identified that they could sell more expensive but also for the drawing parts because they had more trust towards their clients within all that process they also started talking more to their customers and their resellers or their dealers and by doing that they gained a lot of trust and increased again the numbers of offers they received companies considered them again as a supplier what they didn't do before and i think i speak for many people here in in the in the webinar you know that sometimes these discussions about prices can be quite they can have quite a great some friction um and in the pricing pricing process for this company they got a much leaner process because suddenly the conversations were based on data because they realized okay we are positioned this way or that way so the pricing decisions were much easier and the inside sales team that in the end communicated the prices to the customer they trusted much more in the prices so they were much more confident and also offering parts of that price so if i want to give you something or if i should give you something to take away from this from this little deep dive is if you have growth goals in your service business you always need to start to look at your data the data it and also the internal data so for example look at your install base so how much uh revenue per machine do you have how many offers do you receive per machine and then also look does it deviate in different regions in different for different customer segments or you can um check the sales history for different parts for your purchasing parts for your uh for your drawing parts are they developing in a different manner look at your win rates look at your win rates and if you don't have this kpi you need to implement it this is one of the most informative information decision base for a decision you can you can have it within your pricing decisions and finally talk to your customers and your dealers because they reflect quite honestly why they don't buy from you or why they buy try to keep up that relation and identify where they're going to be the market and identify where the opportunities are and if you do these analysis do it in a way that you can drill down in different dimensions because that enables you to to spot anomalies and to understand where there are the real growth potentials and if you identify these growth potentials feel free to reach out to get market information for the parts you're talking about because here you can understand how to realize the potentials you're on of rightgo love and so you can adjust the problem so we can machines or the same as third-party machines companies oftentimes don't really strategically think how they can tackle those customers and how they can optimally set their prices for spare parts like Enrico just explained or also how they can design service contracts that actually are attractive modern and match also the needs of the customers so that is exactly what I'd like to talk about in the next 15 minutes also actually a bit of background here and many companies look at how software companies design their services and offerings and that is something way more advanced and that is a super attractive way also to transport that in the board service contracts from machinery companies which are a little bit more classical oftentimes and I'd like to show you how that can be done. So I'd like to talk specifically about a case and I think that illustrates quite well also the topic in general a little bit. We had here a mid-sized machinery company selling smaller mid-sized machines and they were actually looking into doubling their revenue from the after sales and specifically from the service part of their business in a five years period. they were offering the classical way I just mentioned that means billing by the hour time and material type of way also having service contracts which in the end is not nothing else and also selling your time that you are at your customers the only difference is that it's pre-planned with two or three maintenance and service visits per year and then the repairs are still charged at cost on top and they wanted to move away from that make it more attractive and at the same time looking specifically into tackling customers and we are looking into more of an insurance contract hence something that goes rather in the area of a subscription or flat rate type of business and that is exactly what I was talking about earlier with regards to where we can learn from software companies they have been exercising that for years they are moving from license based pricing to subscription based pricing and we see a similar trend in the machinery after sales service business as well. So the one complication that we found quite at the beginning that I think is also true for many machinery companies is that their customer portfolio was quite diverse so there were some risk averse customers there were some heavy usage customers but there were also more casual customers where the criticality of the equipment was not that high so we had to design packages that would be geared and optimized for each of those specific customer segments and that's how we hope we've done that. Last but not least one key element also was and I think that's again is true for many machinery companies that they were a very localized business so they had of course they had quarter but they also had very strong country organizations that were used to running their business on their own be it on the machine side or equipment side but also on the after sales side so we had to convince them as well that they would use the new service packages that we designed centrally that there was some sort of a standardization harmonization but at the same time still allowing for differences and local adjustments and as they would be fitted for the specific country. So how have we done that and that is also a bit of the general framework how we tackle that topic when we are designing packages for after sales or other types of services then we look at three dimensions. The first one is we look at the package structure the one you see in the middle here. So how do packages be designed should they follow a good better best type of approach a functional approach I will explain that in a bit more detail but there's a fundamental decision to be made how the package structure is set up. Secondly the decision about what to put in what types of services are you putting in are you even putting spare parts in consumables training remote predictability and monitoring capabilities stuff like that. So how do we decide to be decided to be decided and of course it is very much driven by the needs of the customers and what they value. Last but not least super important how do I price it that has several dimensions I need to look at my own cost of course I need to look at what competitors are charging and I also need to look at predominantly at the value that's being created so for instance the uptime that we can guarantee with that type of business that we are offering and service we are offering. On the left and right side you see the two dimensions that we integrated. On the left and right side you see the two dimensions that are super important that we integrated and the two perspectives that we integrated into finding actually the right solution for these three parts in the middle. So on the left side of course we had to talk with customers you can't design something if you don't know what actually the needs of the customers are and we were surprised also how low the maturity of that companies or many companies that we're working with was in actually understanding what types of customers they are dealing with and what they are valuing. So we ran online surveys we also did deep dive interviews and that gave us a super good picture of what customers actually want and how we can segment them different needs based segments. Secondly of course you need to also look at the internal perspective so there's some cost of the service that we need to look at. There's a very simple part with regards to the hourly price the hourly cost also the spare parts price but at the same time if we move more into a type of a flat rate package we need to have some prediction we need to have some prediction on how much specific equipment in a specific context of a customer would probably be costing with regards to maintenance and repairs over time. We looked at internal data and of course also internal expert input the last one for instance specifically judging what is the failure probability of specific parts that went into the calculation of that. So keep this entire frame in mind. And I will walk you through that one by one. Let's talk about the customer perspective first. So now I'm referring to the left side of the previous slide. This is now a super simplified result of what came out of those customer surveys and the deep dive interviews. But I still think it's quite sophisticated in itself. We listed all the different potential value elements here that you see for instance quick response time issue resolution, long term equipment reliability, long term equipment reliability, downtime, service flexibility, the cost and so on and so forth. And we did it of course specifically for different customer segments. There were more than just the two you see on the right side here. You see the green line, you see the yellow line. Those are the key major segments that were identified. There were more behind that. But what you can see is that it follows a clear trend. They have a similar valuation for the sort of the sequence of what's important to them. But the overall importance is sort of parallel shifted. There were more segments to that. That was a bit more sophisticated than what you can see here. For the sake of simplicity, we boiled it down here to two segments. And what is important is to understand what customer segments, how can we describe them to actually identify them? So can we link the two lines, for instance, to a specific industry or application or company size or something like that? And that is what we do. So we actually did. So we have specific customers behind that. But if a new customer comes along, we need to be able to put them in rather green or yellow in that case, of course. So that was also one integral part of that. Taking this analysis to a bit more general frame, it leads us also to the conclusion with regards to the structure of the packages. So there are four major types, let me put it like that, of needs patterns. The one that you saw previously very much refers to the first one here, the needs pattern number one. On the axis, you have the same sort of parameter. So on the vertical axis, you have the different criteria. And on the horizontal axis, you have the importance. So there you would have three segments here, similar valuation, but parallel shift. And that usually calls for something that we call good, better, bests. These are packages that you know, brown, silver, gold, something like that. So they increase with content, but in itself, they are similar. Second one is also a similar needs pattern, but then you have specific elements where specific customer types and have a completely different valuation, more or less. And that's oftentimes calls for something where you have core packages, then plus add-ons, the yellow dots here then would be the add-ons because they are not for every customer have the same importance. Needs pattern three, usually is customers that we call functionally different. So take the LinkedIn example, it's the same platform. But if you are a recruiter, you have completely different needs than someone who's doing sales. So you have the sales navigator, you have the recruiter package, and these are then also functional packages, hence geared toward a specific target audience and customer segment. And they might then also differ quite a bit with regards to the functionality and the features that you put inside. And if it's rather uniform, of course, then also a one-size-fits-all package can work well. In the end, we came up with something like this. So you see basic essential professional, a very typical way to structure it. Oftentimes three packages work well, can also have two or four. But I think three has proven quite well for many companies. There are the different features in here, don't overload them. So in this case, we have five here. And that was very much based on the needs of those specific customer segments. Basic in this example here was clearly linked to one target segment. Essential was linked to one target segment. And professional was also linked to one specific target segment. The thing that many companies or machinery companies are not doing right now is that they also bundle spare parts and consumables into their service packages, because that's a little bit unpredictable, of course, how much you might be using for maintenance. That's rather predictable for repairs. It's not so much predictable. In that case, we actually did it. And that is then also the subscription type of business or flat rate type of contracts that we put together here, which really needs a way more sophisticated simulation and forecasting of what could be the potential cost for specific customer and their equipment and their specific context. Let's talk about the price. There are several elements you can and should look at here and would like to do is that we combine different lenses on price ranges that serve as an input to come up with a price decision. There are three major categories that you see on the left side. So we started, of course, with a cost base. So if we simply predict how much it would cost us to serve a specific contract type, and if we put a certain target contribution, margin on it, that gives us a window on it, that gives us a window on it. That gives us a window on our CFO would say that is what I expect from you guys. But of course, it's just the internal perspective. There's also the external perspective for that. And in this case, we used two lenses to look at that. The simplest thing you can do is to look at your internal data and sum up by customer what have they spent with us, summing up all the different service and maintenance repairs, etc. Spare parts they have bought from us in a given time period. And that also gave us a range that of course depends a little bit by customer. But across our customer portfolio, the rose bar shows you that. Last but not least, we also looked at the price perception that is still a little bit different because the middle one oftentimes is not transparent to many customers. They don't do the effort actually we found of summing up what are they spending with us. So they wouldn't be even able to tell. But we also want to make sure that it feels right for them. And that when we present a price with them, they will be able to tell. You will be able to buy in for that and they can see the value of that. So we ask them with specific pricing method here for best methodology to come up also with an expected price range. And the combination of that then gives you a window where you can decide them strategically how to position yourself and how to put the prices for the service packages, of course, dependent on the customer segment and the package. Let me sum it up. So what we found here was that it is super important to get a few things right before improving your service contracts and making them more sophisticated, maybe even moving into a flat rate type of business. First data is key. So especially if you move into a flat rate type of service contract, what you need to know is this, what have we been spending? What are we spending for with regards to services and spare parts for specific equipment for specific customer to be able to run probabilities and forecasts with regards to the cost. And we find that many companies don't have that. They aren't able to link the service cost to specific equipment on their installed base and their customers. Secondly, service operating model. It of course requires a new way of working. If you work in a more predictive kind of way and it's with a new responsibility and I'm talking specifically about that flat rate package, you go out and it's a new responsibility to make sure that the equipment runs. So you need to organize yourself differently as opposed to if you're reactive and you just wait. You need to organize yourself for the call for the call of a customer. Leadership buy-in is super important. I talked about that in the beginning with regards to the local country organizations. So this can't be rolled out if a leadership is not on top of it. If they don't get the service sales behind them, the service organization to roll it out because they need to be convinced that it's the right thing to sell to the customer. Oftentimes it's a new thing to sell and that brings them out of their comfort zone. Lastly, Salesforce as well training for them to make sure we convey the value of what we're doing. Ideally linked to let's say output based pricing and component that you can clearly show what is the downtime or let's say the uptime that we can optimize for you. And last but not least also the service organization training following a revised service operating model. With that, we have exactly five minutes left for a few questions I'm asking when we go back. Here it is. First of all, if you want to have a chat with us, a little more deeper with regards to the topics that we discussed today, you'll find our contacts on the slides. It will also be sent to you afterwards after the webinar. So feel free to reach out. But now, yeah, let's see if there are any questions. Keep them coming. You want to take one? Maybe one question that I often get asked because companies are quite afraid that they don't have the data to do all the analysis is what they are asking me is what data do we need to do the market research? And there I can say to you that what is needed is that we do research your parts for the manufacturer manufacturer name and the manufacturer part number. So that helps to then in the end compare apples with apples. Yeah, we have a question here Enrico. How do you analyze the competitor data? Which sources do you use? Yeah, so what we do is we research from the perspective of your of your customer. Meaning what they do is they receive your offer and then they copy copy and paste Siemens the customer. And then they look it up online and then they look it up online for example. And that's exactly the behavior that we are we are mimicking. So we research all resources online and we are connected with more than 10,000 shops worldwide. And there's a second one, which tools to use for customer service? I guess I can take that one. It really depends on how sophisticated you want to become. So what I didn't mention is this running that exercise that I did and we did for that company, the Champions League is that you do a Conjoint analysis that requires quite a few respondents and you need a panel for that. It needs a specialized company that have those tools that can do that. But of course, also with homegrown tools and the simple Microsoft forms or software that can be done. There are many standard softwares out there. Call us if you want suggestions on how to run it specifically. But there's not a lot of sophistication required to really get some good value out of that. And if you want to go Champions League, yes, the blue Conjoint analysis. And hire a specialised company for that. I think the tool generally saying is not bottleneck usually. The tool in B2B business is rather do you get the required number of respondents? And of course, then the typical way would be to start on your customer base. Even more interesting, of course, the customers that you haven't worked with so far. And then it becomes a little bit more tricky. But there are also ways how to get to those. Next question is for you. So I can just read for you to customers want only inspections and then decide for parts. You have any experience selling already an upfront payment and then they don't use the transfer. Or they can use the transfer for the year after. Yes, of course, there are customer segments that work like that. And I think the key element was here. And also in our case, like you have seen it to identify those that really see a value in having such a flat rate package. Because usually the ones where the equipment criticality is super high. So the cost of the downtime is super high. But at the same time, those that aren't really sophisticated, oftentimes what we see is that the criticality is extremely high. They have built up their own capabilities to run the service and they actually don't need it from you. They are overqualified, so to say. But there's a sweet spot in between criticality is super high. Capabilities not so high. All right, good. Last question. If nothing else comes in, then we would like to say thanks a lot for tuning in this morning. It was great to have you guys here. Reach out if you have further questions. We're happy to discuss. And then we wish you a happy Thursday. Thank you. Goodbye.